KATE: You were always afraid that she was going to find something. While keeping a matter-of-fact tone throughout the book, bursts of emotion break through and you can really feel the pain that the Bagby's went through. "Every time I saw Shirley I'd think, 'That's the finger that pulled the trigger on the gun that killed Andrew,'" says Kate. The film doesn't mention what consequences Jusitce Gail Welsh faced for allowing Shirley Turner to walk free. the eventual turning of a bill they drafted actually becoming law. David Bagby has written such a poignant account of the sordid happenings and has brought both Andrew and Zachary alive on the pages. The decision was put on hold, however, with an appeal hearing scheduled for September. And it was the happiest they had been since the days before their son was murdered. At first, visitation was limited to one wonderful, torturous hour a week with Zachary. After reading what happened to that poor innocent little boy I truly think that the people responsible for leaving him with his dangerous, violent suicidal mother should do hard time in prison. Tragedy, doubled Andrew Bagby, a gregarious family-practice resident at Latrobe, was found shot to death on Nov. 5, 2001, in Keystone State Park. Mr. BAGBY: (Talking in group) This is about making public exactly what, MORRISON: The Bagbys' public outrage had some results. As always you can unsubscribe at any time. of a woman and a baby on the beach, and I lost it again. then one day I realized what it was. In the wake of the shocking turn of events, Andrew's father, David Bagby, wrote a true crime memoir that is described as "a eulogy for a dead son, an elegy for lives cut tragically short, and a castigation of a broken system.". At the time, Turner was wanted in the U.S. to face trial for the murder of Andrew Bagby. "Kate and I are very close and that helps. It was deeply affecting and the saddest true crime story I have ever heard of. Cpl. They would go to Pennsylvania to collect the body and belongings of their only child. By this stage, he had moved to a new job in the US. Anything to be with Zachary, Kate says. The full hour will not be available online. Mr. BAGBY: The police didn't give us very much information, but they started. Mr. BAGBY: What a flake. So intense, horrifying, and yet inspired by the love and devotion of Andrews parents and their dedication to raise and teach their one and only sweet grandson. MORRISON: Was it reasonable for the court to trust her? The couple had met in medical school at Memorial University of Newfoundland. At least he might have asleep when she went in. He'd been shot five times, including once in the back of the head, execution style. He eventually moved on to a residency in Latrobe, Pa., and she went to work as a family practice doctor in Council Bluffs, Iowa. Mr. BAGBY: Without those cell phone records, they couldn't formally charge. MORRISON: Winter is capricious in Newfoundland; repeatedly, spring is briefly offered and then taken back again. Was it a tight bond? MORRISON: Andrew's best friend, filmmaker Kurt Kuenne, suddenly, just knew what he had begun as a small film to memorialize his old friend. Temptation Island: What Happened To Casey & Ashley After Season 2? She. Those words, David says, are burned into my heart.. The. Thought that maybe he had found somebody that he could really be happy with. He loved to laugh, Kate says. However awkward Shirley Turner made it, they were sweet, cooperative. MORRISON: It was November 2001 when Dr. Andrew Bagby, 28 years old, was found in hospital scrubs lying facedown in the state park in Derry Township, Pennsylvania. (Sea at night; photo of Shirley and Zachary; autopsy report; photo of man; photo of Shirley and Zachary; Zachary sleeping; David and Kate), Mr. BAGBY: Kate just quit. Shirley Turner had walked out to the end, of a pier with tiny Zachary strapped to her body with a sweater, then jumped, into the ocean. Andrew and Zachary's murders. He didnt know what to make of it then. Add a bio, trivia, and more. I had two sisters already, so a brother, because now I'd have somebody that I can teach about hockey and, (Shears and Zachary; photo of Shears and Zachary). I was like, `Oh, OK, yeah.' I was just gone. This is a heartbreaking book written about Andrew Bagby and also about his son Zachary by Andrew's dad David Bagby. Both of them were victims of murder. Authorities later determined his former lover Dr.. MORRISON: Do you find yourself going back and playing that back in your mind? My gut just churned. her. GARDNER: (Audio recording) I understand that. How could they dither for months and months. And if you haven't seen it, you need to. After breaking up at the final bonfire and ultimately reconciling, here's what David and Kate have been up to since Temptation Island season 2 aired. Mr. BAGBY: She told the court she was afraid we would harm the baby. a--with a hand grenade in the kitchen with the pin already pulled. I don't think I could have done what they did. Do you feel all right about putting, MORRISON: Safe and warm inside the Bagby house, as the gales of a, Newfoundland winter raged outside, the inevitable happened. It, (Photo of Shirley; Shirley, Zachary and David; photos of Shirley and Zachary). killed herself and Zachary in a murder-suicide. Dance with the Devil is a eulogy for a dead son, an elegy for lives cut tragically short, and a castigation of a broken system. MORRISON: It was August 2003, the wee hours of the morning by the ocean. While battling the extremely long court system in Canada, they did all they could to keep things civil between themselves and the accused murderer of their son. They moved to Newfoundland to give the legal battle their full attention but Turner remained at large. A judge ruled that Turner's detention was not in the public interest and released her on bail. But a few weeks later, she showed up in Pennsylvania, unexpected, for the wedding of one of his friends. David was taking pictures, Kate says. Mr. SHEARS: Mm, yeah. I haven't read this book yet but I have seen the documentary Dear Zachary. MORRISON: What was it like to hear that she was going to get out of prison? For the first time in years, David Bagby and his wife Kate are decorating their home for Christmas. KATE: Ah, it was wonderful. especially long work day and dropped himself in front of the television. He had returned to the US and had discovered a passion for family practice, where his love for people--and theirs for him--seemed as natural, as comfortable as the quiet town in Pennsylvania in which he'd chosen to live. Very brave parents. KATE: I knew exactly what my son looked at before he died. "When people have seen Dear Zachary, they gasp," says David. Zachary enjoyed himself in the water and a couple of hours later the Bagbys drove Turner and the baby home. The 13-month-old boy died when his mother, Dr. Shirley Turner, held him and jumped into the frigid North Atlantic near Conception Bay South, N.L. Please try again. Father murdered. Immortalized in the spellbinding documentary Dear Zachary, this angry, raw, and brutally honest memoir of murder and loss chronicles a system's failure to prevent the death of a child. (Supreme Court building; Shirley being escorted from court; photos of Kate and. Very, very serious. ago [removed] duraraross 5 mo. She's very active online and has kept fans updated on her dating life, including her new man. Around 11:30 PM Shirley came downstairs, asking to borrow T.J.'s car. But something kept me going, and. MORRISON: When somebody tells you that your mother may have--was a suspect Mr. SHEARS: No, it has to be a mistake. Kuenne said he's grateful that politicians championed a law that could save lives. Get Morning Report and other email newsletters. A variation on glop, adds David, but it was good, often. And now I want to read the book. While the offense with which she is charged is a violent and serious one, the court ruled, it was not directed at the public at large., On Jan. 10, David says, we had to give Zachary back to her.. Why? Well, I said, `Bring some beer. Nobody drives 16 hours after you've just broken up with them.' However, as events transpired, the focus shifted to the incompetence of the Canadian courts in keeping Turner behind bars, as well as the plight of Bagby's parents, David and Kate, as they battled to get custody of the last remnant of their slain son. KATE: I thought, `Well, God, this is it.' It pains me to award only two stars to a book written by David Bagby, but I want to use the Goodreads' ranking system more accurately. And I know, you love me, and--yeah. Home video captured what looked like a. typical domestic scene, but beneath these happy images lies a darker truth. The days Andrew and his buddies would goof-off, watch movies and sleep over right there in the family room. They were in kind of a basement apartment with second-hand furniture. HEATHER: I knew he'd been struggling with me moving on and dating other people. Understood? The Hornet was just back from patrolling . That woman then escapes to Canada while evidence against her is gathering, and then she has his baby while the extradition process drags on. Neither speaks for the other. 1 Photo. I had a son I used, (Photo of young Kate; photo of Kate and David; photo of Kate and Andrew), KATE: And then suddenly you're in the pits, and then you have to learn that, MORRISON: Two weeks after Zachary's murder, the press covered a, Mr. BAGBY: (Press conference) We believe that the legal system helped her to, MORRISON: Charging the child protection authorities dropped the, ball, and that a disastrous bail system allowed a probable first-degree, (Zachary; court document; Shirley and Andrew). (Photo of Andrew; cell phone towers; photo of Shirley; maps; suburban street; photo of house; newspaper clipping; photo of Shirley; maps; cell phone tower; Shirley in court; court documents; flashing police lights; American flag. I was just hoping more from this book, but I can understand it. After trying to make things work for a while, the pair realized they wouldn't be able to overcome all the negativity and obstacles that developed in their relationship after their time onTemptation Island. you have anywhere to put that, or that Ms. TURNER: (Audio recording) Not yet. The legal system helped her kill Zachary. Feb 15, 2022 kate and david bagby still alive. From the first episode, it seemed Kate was more invested in the relationship than David. Zachary was learning some words well, words he understood that Kate and David were sure they understood, too. I sat there. MORRISON: Life for Andrew Bagby was good. No question. Or it's in the car. And Shears says his mother was good to him when he was a child. Kurt Kuenne created the movie as a kind of big-screen scrapbook to immortalize Andrew Bagby, one of his best friends from childhood. Except he picked up as this reporter was leaving a voicemail explaining the call from Newfoundland to Sunnyvale, Calif. Mr. BAGBY: Oh, this ranks right up there. David Bagby speculates that this was Shirley's idea of victory: when Andrew and Zachary both rejected her, she punished them. 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Justice Gail Welsh justified allowing Shirley to walk because there was "no evidence" of Shirley having mental dysfunctions that made her a danger to society. It turns out Shirley owned a .22 caliber handgun, which she acquired while living in Iowa. I mean, she. For one thing, Shirley, required the Bagbys to bring Zachary to visit her once a week in jail. Two months later, with the extradition process still grinding on, Turner announced she was pregnant with Andrew's child. "The birth of Zachary gave us part of Andrew back," says Kate. Just rage. The documentary was also made with the intention of being given to Andrew's son Zachary to explain the full story of his family. And she followed Andrew to St. John's.. I always thought life was good until Andrew was killed, Kate says, sitting in her Sunnyvale kitchen. Ms. TURNER: (Audio recording) Then I can't consent to more time right now. It looked like an open-and-shut case but, before the police could arrest her, Turner fled over the Canadian border, back home to St John's, in Newfoundland. The rest of the documentary describes the fallout of Zachary's death, but for his family and for the judicial system. That was the last time the Bagbys saw Zachary alive. Book details an absolute tragedy in the Canadian justice system. Now that Zachary was starting to walk, he was free to make a beeline to. The Fridays he and a classmate from Bellarmine College Preparatory would come home early and fix dinner in that kitchen. Right? Maybe the last time you talked to Shirley there was some very subtle change in tone. American authorities asked Canadian, authorities to send her back to the US, which would require an extradition, hearing. She, floored by grief. The Bagbys, whod already been traveling back and forth to Canada for the extradition hearings, knew what they had to do. The good life started in earnest when Kate first laid eyes on Petty Officer David Bagby, who was serving on the USS Hornet, docked in Long Beach in 1967. You can't tell them this over the phone. I didnt know Americans could quote Shakespeare.'. I just want to get through medical school.'. Sitting with Kate and David in the sunny house where they raised their son, its almost as if they can see those days right in front of their eyes. Shirley Turner had some startling news. Andrew Bagby was an easygoing man with a wide circle of friends who found it almost impossible to say no to people. Canadian authorities arrested Turner in early December 2001, but fatefully, released her on bail as she waited for a series of decisions regarding Pennsylvanias request for extradition. But I used to look at her hand and think, it. MORRISON: Coming up, Andrew dead. But he was accepted here, St. John's, Newfoundland, the easternmost point in North America. And he's like, `I'm not looking for anything serious. Twelve years older, she became obsessed with him. Mother a murderer. Mr. BAGBY: By this time we're pretty damn sure she's complete. Then, 8.5 months after Andrew Bagby was murdered - July 18, 2002 - Turner gave birth to a boy, who she named Zachary Turner. The next day, his body was found riddled with bullets. Dear Zachary: A Letter to a Son About His Father (2008) 1 Video. Turner was twice divorced and one of her last three noteworthy partners was murdered, another was living in fear of her in Pennsylvania and the third was complaining to police that Dr. Turner had harassed him.. whether she was capable of hurting Zachary. It didn't clue in, MORRISON: T.J. says while he was touched that she'd shown up at, the hospital, he was also a little surprised. We lived for that hour every week.. Laws governing the, rights of defendants are fairly strong in this country, but there's something, about Newfoundlanders in particular which may have contributed to the judge's, decision to grant bail. I have been interested in True Crime for years, but somehow I had never heard of this story until I found the documentary on Netflix. And we, would have agreed to anything. They really wanted to have a relationship with their grandchild. Unidentified Woman #12: We won't forget their son. David Bagby, who plans to send a copy of his book to key Canadian legislators, says he will continue to fight for bail reform. It also analyzed reviews to verify trustworthiness. Cpl. Since this was written by the first victim's father, little to no backstory was provided for the accused murderer. The Bagbys hoping to gain custody of Zachary moved to Newfoundland and began a long, drawn-out battle in court and with Canadian social services to protect their grandson from the woman who had almost certainly murdered their son. A couple whose son and grandson were murdered are celebrating a new law that empowers Canadian courts to refuse bail when a suspect's child may be in danger. I thought it was just going to chronicle a murdered man's life, for his son to reflect back on when he was older - because his father was killed before he was born. The murder-suicide was a huge news story in Canada. The ending was so shocking, I was screaming with David Bagby That bitch! Inspired by his mother's tales of interesting medical cases and wonderful patients, Andrew decided he would be a doctor. Shockingly, despite everything that happened both on and after the show, Kate and David made another go of it. GARDNER: (Audio recording) Would you be willing to turn the gun into your local police department so they could get it to us to let us look at it? They did their best to keep their dark feelings about their son's accused. And that always radiated through the house.. There was a problem loading your book clubs. It was the result the couple had been waiting for. A man, who would not give police his name, called the Royal Newfoundland Constabulary to report that he had met Turner in a St. Johns bar and that he later had sex with her. Andrew Bagby broke up with Shirley but she lured him to an isolated location where she shot him 5 times. fc-falcon">kate and david bagby still alive sms online empfangen neue nummer June 1, 2022. It changes the Criminal Code, allowing courts to refuse bail for suspects accused of serious crimes when anaccused'schild or children under the age of 18 may be in danger. The movie had me in tears and in rage all at once. He said, `Well, it's 4:30 now. I can understand that. The suicide, he says, confirmed what he never wanted to believe that his mother was a murderer. MORRISON: But then things changed. KATE: People thought she was delicate, you know, and looked KATE: She couldn't kill. MORRISON: But would that somebody turn out to be a blessing or a curse? Reviewed in the United States on October 1, 2022. When I read true crime, I like to see more back story of the people involved. He was developing a personality. One of the best books that I have ever read. David Bagby, left, and Kate Bagby, right, celebrate with their son Andrew Bagby at his graduation from medical school at Memorial University of Newfoundland in June 2000. What do you want it Mr. BAGBY: Very seriously. Ms. TURNER: (Audio recording) His parents don't even know, do they? Mrs. Kate Holland Bagby, age 101, of Flowery Branch entered into eternal rest with her Heavenly Father on Tuesday, Oct. 2, 2012, at her residence following a short illness. What if she is backed in a. corner? KATE: So this man said to me, `Do you know that Shirley Turner's pregnant with your son's child? She was placed on suicide watch after intake screening. "All I could say was: 'My son is dead? First published in 2007, Dance with the Devil: A Memoir of Murder and Loss follows Andrew's family as they . If both parties dont recognize that, he says, then youve got trouble.. When theyre telling their story, David will invariably ask Kate whether shed like to start a particular chapter, or should he? On November 3, 2001, he broke up with Turner at the airport before putting her on a plane back to Council Bluffs, 1,300 miles away. I think it was supposed to be just a brief college romance, says Kurt Kuenne, Andrews close friend since first grade at St. Andrews School in Saratoga. was that they'd have to accept her daily phone calls. But how? For David, of course, there is the book, but there is also the caldron of emotion that refuses to let him rest until hes sure hes done all he can to prevent others from going through what he and Kate have endured. MORRISON: Shirley Turner, also a doctor in training, was 12 years older than Andrew, twice divorced, a mother of three. Newfoundland to meet the now 11-month-old little boy. He was to us, like our gift from God. MORRISON: When another of Andrew's best friends, Kurt Kuenne, heard about the murder, he also went into a tailspin. But Turner did a strange thing: she woke Zachary up and said to him: "Say goodbye to Grandma and Grandad. The only thing about his life that didn't make sense to some friends and family was his relationship with that doctor from Newfoundland, the one he'd started dating when going to medical school there. GARDNER: (Audio recording) I'm interested in the gun. As Kate and David talk about their son, you can see the teamwork. He is campaigning to change Canadian bail law so no one charged with murder is allowed to walk the streets like Shirley Turner. Mr. BAGBY: He's now engaged to this lovely girl, and he's going to go to med school. I just finishes the book, and for a first-time writer I thought the writing was excellent. I'm tired of this. They sometimes visited with Zachary and Turner as if nothing had happened. He says his mother was so often, unavailable, especially from the time she started medical school. I got to go to the trial. Reviewed in the United States on March 14, 2022. He was especially delighted to hear that David and Kate Bagby are once again hauling out boxes of Christmas decorations that went unused for so long. MORRISON: Kurt and Andrew grew up together in Northern California, where the fledgling director gave Andrew starring roles in some of his earliest ventures. But the book is also the story of a remarkable couple whose journey of grief took them from the suburban comfort of Northern California to the harsh coast and courts of Newfoundland, Canada. Mr. BAGBY: We first got to see him personally in family court. My heart aches for Kate and David Bagby. They know they deal with their grief differently and they honor that. I have to tell you that Andrew is dead. It was the last time the Bagbys would see Zachary. Why would she say that if he wasn't? Kate on average, especially at the beginning, tended to break down in despair and tears, David says. A tragedy that could have been prevented. But in January 2003, the legal system confounded their expectations yet again. The watch was continued after a more comprehensive psychological exam. Everyone could see how far off the deep end Shirley Turner was, including the very justice system that continued to set her free and place an innocent child in her arms. This book is more about how the justice system failed and 2 more people are dead because of it. In the, tribute documentary their son's best friend Kurt Kuenne was making to someday, give Zachary, the Bagbys' friends recount how difficult it was for David and. She picked Zachary up and wandered for an hour or more along coastal roads and paths. It was a joy and Zachary was much loved, Kate says. whose parents are charged with a violent crime. Sold and delivered by Audible, an Amazon company, By completing your purchase, you agree to Audibles. Instead, our system considers things like how recent a review is and if the reviewer bought the item on Amazon. Andrew Bagby was a genial boy with dark hair hanging over his cherubic face. Temptation Islandairs Tuesdays at 10 pm ET on USA. Oh, my God. It is recommended that you watch the film first before reading on (though do be warned it is NOT an easy or pleasant watch in the slightest. I'm absolutely sure. We would've done handstands and cartwheels to. On Nov. 14, a Canadian judge ruled that Turner should indeed be jailed while arguments continued on whether she should be sent back to the United States. Then, even if the court orders extradition, Canadas federal justice minister must decide whether to hand over the fugitive to U.S. authorities. Immortalized in the spellbinding documentary Dear Zachary, this angry, raw, and brutally honest true crime memoir of murder and loss chronicles a system's failure to prevent the death of a child. And in the meantime, without that crucial piece of evidence to charge her with Andrew's murder, Shirley Turner quietly left US soil and returned home to Newfoundland. MORRISON: So different from who Andrew really was, a kind, devoted son who made Eagle Scout at 15. We had to pack up Zachary, Mr. BAGBY: We just climbed right back upstairs and went to bed and melted. Some months ago I watched the documentary, "Dear Zachery" on Netflix. Andrew assured his filmmaker friend Kurt that the 40-year-old was a passing fancy. The Bagbys attended the hearing, of course, and, could not quite believe their ears when they heard the judge's ruling. A security guard reported hearing a. Mr. SHEARS: When we woke up in the morning, realized they weren't there. MORRISON: But she was allowed to go back to Newfoundland? Neue nummer June 1, 2022 lover Dr.. morrison: what happened Casey., torturous hour a week with Zachary Bagby, one of his friends. She punished them. ' could n't kill John & # x27 ; s everything happened. Repeatedly, spring is briefly offered and then taken back again hand and,! 'S now engaged to this lovely girl, and, could not quite believe their ears they... Streets like Shirley Turner to walk, kate and david bagby still living says, then youve got trouble it. The sordid happenings and has brought both Andrew and his buddies would,! 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